Skip to end of metadata
Go to start of metadata

Web Meeting Info:

Join Zoom Meeting - | Meeting ID: 718 380 6281  P: 370553 

+1 646 558 8656 US (New York) | Find your local number:



3:30PM EDT (UTC-4). Note that the calls are now two hours in duration.   Today we will end early and continue longer with the cochairs for planning for the WGM next week.


None received.


Agenda Topics and Notes

  1. Roll call and Agenda check (Chair)
    Call began at 3:35PM EDT with quorum reached.
    FM steps for Mary Kay and UTG
  2. Announcements (all)
    • Harsh Sharma has declined the position of Vocab WG cochair and has resigned.
      Reuben has notified Karen and the seventh cochair slot for vocabulary WG has been closed.

  3. Action Items Check  (Chair)
    1. We acknowledge that we need to take care of the items on this list. Rob asks that co-chairs especially review their action items and resolve or update
    2. Attendees and especially chairs are again urged to finish and check off their action items.
    3. Reuben created the page for the Name&Shame list

  4. Next WGM Planning (Carol Macumber)
    Planned schedule for the WGM will be added soon. Current latest does are Connectathon January 13-15, and the WGM January 25-29.

  5. Review of new PSS involving Vocabulary (chairs)
    There is a Confluence page relative to this where we can see the new projects in review and started.  We should comment on these or at least review to make sure they are not something we need to get involved with.  Note that the items on this page are projects that are either looking for sponsors/cosponsors, interested parties, or related projects in HL7 that the listed proposed project should be made aware of.
    No new projects listed, nothing to do today.

  6. Co-chair Items
    1. Nothing to bring forward today.

  7. Vocabulary Policy Items Needing Decisions (Ted Klein)
    1. No new WG decisions from the Task Forces yet.
    2. Lots of dimensions to the URI Situation:
      1. Rob M is working on the process for creating a URI for a new code system.   This task force meets right after the Gender Harmony project call.
      2. The three activities that are working on this stuff will try to discuss and perhaps participate in each others' calls to make sure we do not have duplicative and conflicting recommendation.
      3. We need to address our URI assignment/change policy for value sets, as this issue is not only for code systems.
      4. Rob McClure will take the lead to get this straightened out with Pat T, Saul, Mary Kay, Carol M, Rob H to help them get untangled. There is an FM call on Tuesday 11AM ET.

  8. Documentation Page for MED-RT (Jessica Bota/Carol/Rob Hausam)

    The page of information for using MED-RT in FHIR was updated and HTA and the updaters want a quick review on today's call.   It can be found at: 
    Following review, Rob H or Jess (as VA rep) will post an announcement and call for comment on the Zulip implemented and Terminology channels.    This page represents the resolution of the FHIR ticket for Med-RT.  

    1. Last call it was determined that more information about MED-RT would be needed since only portions can be represented by FHIR. Suggested addition:

      “The MED-RT Code System includes relationships between MED-RT concepts and concepts in external Code Systems, as well as relationships between concepts only in the external Code Systems. The external Code Systems that MED-RT references include RxNorm, MeSH, and SNOMED CT US Edition. 

      The contents of this page are intended to represent concepts defined as existing solely in MED-RT and does not include relationships that reference concepts in the external Code Systems. For more information on MED-RT, see”

      Robust discussion of the wording of this second sentence, with much disagreement.  We made substantial progress at last week's WGM.   We came to agreement, there is a ticket FHIR-28553, and Rob H is on the hook draft the wording and get the final changes done.   We will remove this item once the material is in the ci build so we can keep nagging (smile)

      The tracker FHIR-28553 shows it Applied but there are still some small nits to be resolved.  It was pointed out that we do not have information on the many relationships in MED-RT; we agreed another ticket to add this should be entered.  Carol M suggests that Jess should do this as it is related to her main VA responsibilities.   Rob H will assist.   Remove this from the vocab calls we are done with this effort.

  9. UTG Update (Carol/Jess/Ted)
    1. Status
      1. Release 2.0.0 will hopefully be done next week
      2. We will do the large scale full rollout before end of month
      3. All information is posted on the  UTG confluence pages and immediate priorities are on UTG Project Tasks broken down by milestone (i.e. publish Release 1 of content)
      4. The FHIR CS and VS content has been updated in UTG and the versions set as per zulip thread discussion
      5. Continued to work on Submitter Educational Sessions
        1. First THREE webinars are complete: Community Intro, HL7 Members, UTG Reviewers/Voters.
          1. Latest session for reviewers available here:
        2. Work almost done for the first in the final series of three sessions for Submitters of change proposals 
      6. Continued to work on Documentation updates and organization
        1. Melva is doing a better layout of the materials and can be found on a dedicated Space for UTG
        2. We plan to complete the documentation for the rollout before end of month
      7. Open Content Issues
        1. The V3 coremif being generated by the UTG build pages is not valid
          1. Lloyd hopes to get toward on this by Sunday or Monday
        2. In progress of fixing remaining value sets with NUCC bad enumerated codes in the HIPAA value sets (Ted/Rob M)
          1. We will create the new tab for Retired for value sets and move theses bad ones into there
          2. Grahame needs to tell us what to do to inhibit the expanding of these with the errors
        3. NamingSystem.title URI corrections for remaining systems is done
        4. Warnings for bad markup in descriptions
        5. An issue with the FHIR normative value set designation-use does not have the codes needed to get rid off 1300+ warnings
      8. Workflow Tasks
        1. Should be all complete
    2. Pilot update
      1. An 8th ticket UP-68 was implemented this week
    3. Discussion/Decision items 
      1. A standing agenda item was added to the UTG call to review open tickets
      2. It was agreed at the September WGM that will be the single repository for external Code Systems at HL7. 
        1. A plan is being created and will involve a separate governance process for external code systems
      3. Per WGM, Reuben is creating and publishing a list of CodeSystems to be removed from UTG, including a deadline for community review
        1. The communication will include the action to be taken with the CodeSystems in question and the criteria by which they were placed on the list
      4. During a long discussion at the FHIR connectathon, it was decided that we will use NamingSystem for identifier management broadly.  
        1. This means immediately that we will have a NamingSystem resource instance for every UTG code system.   In addition, we are looking into adding something to the CodeSystem resource to indicate that it is a 'stub' i.e. an empty resource that exists solely to house informative metadata, but contains no content or technical information about the code system (e.g. hierarchy meanings, properties, case sensitivity, etc.)
      5. Need to define precise process to work through non-HL7 content in UTG
        1. Ongoing calls/meetings with Reuben, Ted, and Rob H to flesh this all out completely and bring to HTA and Vocab.   Working page of notes is here.
    4. Immediate Priorities
      1. Fix content issues (see Open Content Issues section above) and Publish Release 2.0.0 of the UTG content
      2. Continue to test the final process for implementing vocabulary changes
      3. Work on resolution of the new errors introduced by version 1.1.2 of the Publisher
      4. Finish educational materials for Submitters

  10. FHIR Tracker Items (Rob Hausam/Carmela).  Tabled to 9/17 call; request to prep for the session!
    1.  All folks are requested to join the every other Thursday calls on this topic because without attendees no decisions can be made.  The calls alternative with these main Vocab calls.

    2. There are a few issues currently marked 'ready to vote'; please look these over as we hope to vote on them on the call next. (same time slot as this call next week). The JIRA query for this is: The JIRA query is named Vocab: ReadyForVote.  There are a number of items in this ReadyForVote state.   We will work through some if they are ready and listed here.
      1. FHIR-28172 - Getting issue details... STATUS - discussed and will keep on the vocab list
      2. FHIR-27851 - Getting issue details... STATUS - should be discussed at the FHIR-I session. This code system should be moved.   (Ted added this ticket to the agenda, as an example of a general issue)
        Rob M moves that this code system be moved to the HL7 Terminology (URL should be changed to be rooted in; in addition the compose for the value set that references this code system (
), Carmela seconds.   Discussion and formal vote in ticket.   Followup:   Rob H to implement, Ted and Rob H to discuss ramifications. 
      3. FHIR-27762 - Getting issue details... STATUS - CodeSystem constraint is incorrect - this is an example of where a mistake made its way into a normative resource. The constraint in question is csd-1. If this is truly a mistake, we might need to make a technical correction to R4.  (Ted added this ticket to the agenda as an example of a general issue)
      4. FHIR-27848 - Getting issue details... STATUS
      5. FHIR-23785 - Getting issue details... STATUS
      6. FHIR-27780 - Getting issue details... STATUS - defining expressions for codes in a code system, moved priority to low - this is a "nice to have"

  11. Gender Harmony Project Update (Carol/Rob M)  
    Project is progressing.   Next project meeting is Monday October 5.  Preliminary work is complete albeit with some loose ends.  Plan is to begin the process to define the document which is planned to go to January ballot with a NIB deadline of November 1 and text document for ballot to Lynn by mid-November.  EBM project and the related Covid project have put out documents about creation of code systems; work with JBI has been referenced and is part of all of this.     This material is likely to be both useful and of interest to HL7 and its projects, and guidance for UTG and the Vocabulary WG.  An early draft can be found here.
    1. Need guidance on style of ballot. Originally (and still officially) Informative white paper. Group changed to logical model but have not done UML approach and not sure if that is proper.
    2. Will need to vote on NIB officially on the 10/29 call

  12. Liaison Reports     
    1. ISO (Ted) - Fall 2020 TC215 meeting is virtual only, scheduled for November 12-17.

    2. LOINC (Ted/Rob H) - LOINC meeting held this week on zoom.  It will finish tomorrow.

    3. HTA (Carol/Reuben) -   Work on some of the external material for Mary Kay has begun.   Carol and Reuben are on HTA, Rob M is liaison.

    4. SNOMED (Rob H/Reuben/Peter) - 

  13. New Business
    1. EBMonFHIR are creating code systems for FHIR core.  There will be a lot of Concept Maps.  We should ask this project (ie Brian) to give us occasional updates.

    2. HTA page for NCPDP has been created initially with the information HTA had in hand.  Frank will add to this page and ask Margaret to review.

  14. Next call items
    1. See items remaining in RED above.

The call was ended and adjourned at 5:36PM EDT.  Next call scheduled for Thursday October 29, 2020 at 3:30PM Eastern US Time for two full hours, which would be two weeks from today.  We can consider moving the week for it if there is strong feeling that we should do so, otherwise the suggestion is to continue on the same cycle.  

Action Items

  • Peter Jordanwill reach out to Ron Parker to make sure he follows up on the UTG tickets that need international OSG attention.
  • Ted Klein will reach out to the V2 folks on the cleanup of the OCE codes.