Skip to end of metadata
Go to start of metadata

Web Meeting Info:

Join Zoom Meeting - | Meeting ID: 718 380 6281  P: 370553 

+1 646 558 8656 US (New York) | Find your local number:



3:30PM EDT (UTC-4). Note that the calls are now two houris in duration.



None received

Planned Agenda Topics and Notes

  1. Roll call and Agenda check (Chair)

  2. Announcements (all)
    • . We WILL begin time boxing discussions as we have been unable to complete our decisions or our agenda for two months or more now.

  3. Action Items Check  (Chair)
    1. We acknowledge that we need to take care of the items on this list. Rob asks that co-chairs especially review their action items and resolve or update
    2. Attendees and especially chairs are again urged to finish and check off their action items.

  4. CTS2 Withdrawal (Rob McClure/Carmela)
    1. PSS Approval - Withdraw CTS-2 Standard
    2. Vocab had decided to withdraw it, but this was before the new status available for Standards, an Vince M noted that many folks are still using CTS2.
    3. Goal is that it is still a functional model and a valid specification, but it will not be updated.
    4. If Withdrawal is not the right thing to do, what should we do?   
    5. Rob M noted that the ANSI status is either Active or Withdrawn (does not exist); thus we with withdraw or reaffirm it (retiring it is withdrawing it)
    6. We can Reaffirm it, Update it, or Withdraw it.   Reaffirming it just leaves it in an Active state which is declared Stable.
    7. Since we worked with OMG on this, we really should contact them on our decision for the next step.
    8. We have a NIB in for ballot on this to Reaffirm or Withdraw.   Do we need to pull the NIB to discuss with OMG first?  Or do we just leave it as Reaffirm in the ballot, so it remains as an active standard?
    9. Rob M suggests that Carmela and Vince M speak and figure out how to contact OMG, with the purpose of notifying them that we plan to withdraw the standard and they can take it over if they like.  Or they can take over an effort to update with errata or other information.   With no other information, we will withdraw the Standard.    Rob also suggests that Carmela contact Paul Knapp and Lorraine (SGB) to find out what if any obligations Vocabulary has if we reaffirm it to keep it stable.
    10. If things drag and nothing happens, the ballot will go forward and it will likely be withdrawn.
    11. Everyone is encouraged to look over the NIB that was sent out as the ballot will open real quick.  We will have a status update in the call in two weeks.

  5. Baltimore/September WGM Planning (Chair). Tabled, out of time.   Next call
    HL7 has just announced that the WGM will be held virtually - NOT in Baltimore onsite.    We as yet have no details from HQ, which we need to begin planning for it.   The HL7 anncouncement says the WGM meetings will be held Monday, September 21 (afternoon) - Thursday, September 24; the Plenary session will be on Monday morning.   The agenda for the virtual meeting will be created soon.  We await information from HQ about times and schedule recommendations for the Virtual Sessions.   Perhaps we can give HQ some suggestions as to ways to setup the sessions so that we can make best use of the limited Human Resources.   Carol will set up the blank template and we will begin to work on it once HQ gives us more information.

  6. Vocabulary Policy Items Needing Decisions (Ted Klein)
    1. Code System versioning (UTG Versioning Refinement (Not Yet Approved))
      We had a robust discussion working through the table of elements and what should trigger the versioning updates.  It is documented in the table; the upshot is that the default will be an increment of the Major number for every changed unless explicitly identified in a change proposal as minor, or clearly a typo/spelling/etc correction.  This may cause issues and may be revisited later.

    2. Policy around 'breaking changes'. Tabled, out of time.   Next call

  7. Documentation Page for MED-RT (Jessica Bota/Carol/Rob Hausam)
    The page of information for using MED-RT in FHIR was updated and HTA and the updaters want a quick review on today's call.   It can be found at: 
    Following review, Rob H or Jess (as VA rep) will post an announcement and call for comment on the Zulip implemented and Terminology channels.    This page represents the resolution of the FHIR ticket for Med-RT.   We will bring this back next all.

  8. Guidance for NDC11 for the implementers and IG writers (Rob/Carol/Rob)
    Finish the guidance for NDC11 for the implementers and IG writers, it was NOT completed on the 5/28 call (2020-05-28 Vocab WG Call Agenda/Minutes)   We need to complete the discussion on today's call.
    Do we need to revisit the HTA decisions on this and reopen the issue?  Or put it to bed?   We will have an explicit decision on the implementation of the HTA/Vocab policy decision from May 28 on the next call where we will review documentation of it.

  9. From active email discussion:  "Occupational Data for Health (ODH) Code system contents" (Rob McClure)
    The HL7/HIT community has continuing difficulty finding the source of truth for various commonly used code systems, such as the ODH systems.   What should be the HL7/UTG/HTA policy around these?   HTA has engaged with the discussion on these, and the Mitre folks and some others are engaged in moving forward.   We will get some update on the next call.   Ginny Lundsman has been of help and we should persue deep engagement.  Perhaps we can see if ONC can help in some way?  HTA would be happy to engage, but we do not currently know exactly what the needs are.   To be continued on the next call, may be discussed on the chairs call.

  10. Issues around 'extensible' and 'unknown' (Carol/ Ioana Singureanu /  Jay Lyle). Tabled, out of time.   Next call
    1. There has been some feedback, and progress today.   Many email commentaries 
    2. The project team is working through the comments and changers to address the criticisms
    3. The specific instance of the issue was around the use of a SNOMED code in a coded data element that is extensible (this is not about the value set binding).
    4. It is noted that folks are taking liberties with the encoded of stuff just to get their work done.
    5. This original point is now closed. 
    6. Rob notes that we still need to discuss issues around the use of extensible in the CARIN project (see comment below).   This further related discussion will be placed in a slot for the next call.
    7. We neer to find out from Rob M exactly what the issue is and what needs to be done.   Continue next call.

  11. UTG Update (Carol/Jess/Ted)
    1. Status
      1. All information is posted on the  UTG confluence pages and immediate priorities are on UTG Project Tasks broken down by milestone (i.e. publish Release 1 of content)

      2. Content is published we are essentially live.  Not yet doing the Jira workflow process for updates though
      3. Education webinars are designed and recording will begin next week
        1. Working on second education Webinar for the HL7 community
      4. Content Issues
        1. The coremif from March 2019 (1436) was used to generate release 1.0.0 instead of the December 2019 version (1451).  This has been FIXED
        2. The incorrect FHIR resources were imported. The generated ones with the narrative instead of the git ones that are the source of truth. This has been FIXED.
        3. Due to a timing issue, the FHIR resources for the R5 preview site were updated with their versions after the R4.0.1 versions were imported
          1. Work is underway with Grahame to fix this in UTG
        4. The V3 coremif being generated by the UTG build pages is not working (1.0.0 matches 1.0.18 and we expect changes).
      5. Workflow issues
        1. All known issues addressed
        2. Voting status update done
    2. Pilot underway
      1. We need more folks to go to Jira and look at it and comment on the proposals and/or vote on those in Consensus Review.
      2. Any problems or issues we need to know about as the system has not yet had enough testing and we can only fix the problems we are told about.
      3. Feedback and issues from the Pilot are logged on Participating in UTG Pilot Testing
    3. OID generator for new vocabulary artifacts
      1. We have implemented a Confluence form for this which is at OID Generation 
    4. Discussion/Decision items all UTG items below this are out of time and tabled
      1. The plan is STILL to:
        1. Complete the pilot (need to have proposals approved in order to fully test build/publication tooling)
        2. Get the voting stuff settled with SGB and TSC
        3. Go over where we are with TSC and CTO, and seek Go-Live decision in July
        4. Announce Go-Live to membership and "turn it on" by the end of July
    5. Immediate Priorities
      1. Fix content issues
        1. Need to adjust the extension URL for NamingSystem.title for most of them still
        2. Figure out what the content issue with the generated coremif is
      2. Get educational materials ready 
      3. Schedule Release 2.0.0 of the UTG content

  12. FHIR Tracker Items (Rob Hausam/Carmela).  Limited time - only H below address today.   Next call the other items.
    1. Not yet progress on update of ConceptMap
    2. All folks are requested to join the every other Thursday calls on this topic because without attendees no decisions can be made.  The calls alternative with these main Vocab calls.
    3. Please can folks attend the FHIR tracker calls on the off weeks, we need more people to attend the calls so that we can make progress on the trackers. 
    4. There are a few issues currently marked 'ready to vote'; please look these over as we hope to vote on them on the call next. (same time slot as this call next week). The JIRA query for this is: The JIRA query is named Vocab: ReadyForVote.  There are a number of items in this ReadyForVote state.   We will work through some now:
    5. We tried to get through the one on NamingSystem.title, but could not come to closure; too many knowns on the FHIR governance of spec updates..
    6. We then tried to get through the one on NaminngSystem.use code enhancement for v2 support, and again we could not come to closure as too many unknown in the FHIR governance around maturity level 1 items (code systems, naming system resource, etc) that are code datatypes bound requited to FHIR code systems.  Needs clarification from Grahame/Lloyd.
    7. There is an effort to get another interim FHIR release before R5 with some of the ci build updates; in proposal stage no final decisions yet made.  Zulip chat is here.  The current ci build content is planned to be in it.
    8. The item on ConceptMap maturity is done, and the level is changed to '1'.
    9. Rob H will work on getting another block vote ready on next week's tracker call and bring it for decision on the July 23 Vocab call.

  13. Gender Harmony Project Update (Carol/Rob M)   Tabled, out of time, next call.
    Project is progressing.   Working on figuring out "default values" for the 3 notions.   Every call and meeting progress is being made, document defining these is out for review.  A great set of participants from a wide audience are now actively involved and participating.   Unknown if a document will be ready for ballot in September or not, all these items turn out to be harder than folks think once one begins digging into them.    Folks with questions or suggestions are urged to go to the Confluence page for the project.

    An AMIA panel topic was submitted for this in mid-November around HIMSS.

  14. Liaison Reports     Tabled, out of time, next call.
    1. ISO (Ted) - Fall 2020 meeting tentatively scheduled to be in India in October, but unknown what the status is.  Right now my personal feeling is that it will be cancelled.

    2. LOINC (Ted/Rob H) - New LOINC release: LOINC 2.68 and RELMA 7.1 are now available for download from the website.

    3. HTA (Carol/Reuben) -  HTA continues to work through the external URI issues

    4. SNOMED (Rob H/Reuben/Peter) - For now the Lisbon meeting is proceeding, but not yet a decision on virtual or face-to-face.  But one way or another it will happen. 

  15. New Business
    1. Additionally related HTA item:
 zulip chat.  Active discussion.   We need to make a Vocab WG policy about the precise workflow and decision and sequencing of steps for the changes in canonical URLs.    Critically important item to be agreed, decided, and documented!  This will be on top of the cochairs call agenda next week, then the following week circle back to HTA and Vocab so that Wayne and Grahame can both join for the finalization of the policy.   Julie is invited to next week's cochairs call.

  16. Next call items
    1. See items above that had to be tabled.

The call was ended and adjourned at 5:38PM EDT.  Next call scheduled for Thursday July 23, 2020 at 3:30PM Eastern US Time for two full hours.   

Action items

  • Robert HausamWill bring the documentation for the NDC finalization to the next call on July 23.
  • Caroline Macumber will get the cochairs call credentials to HTA list and the vocab chairs list.